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Honest opinions on K POP?

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I liked a bunch of girl groups but I think they've all split now; I loved Shinee too but haven't been able to listen to anything since Jonghyun died

 

think most boy groups are shit and overrated, ESPECIALLY BTS. They play them on the radio here because theyre so popular in europe and they're really really bad lol 

 

Kpop fans are super immature and annoying on twitter, spamming fancams and saying "oh well if they'd stanned ____ this tragedy wouldnt have happened" but I think most are like 13 or whatever anyway

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It's penis music lol. Okay, I'm not here to talk shit about pop music, especially not Kpop. There's more artistic merit to it than some give it, and many perfectly sane Kpop fans get unfairly lumped in with the Stans. 

 

But man, I used to be really neutral and happy towards Kpop back when I first got into VK, y'know, being like "Hey guys, let's all get along and talk music and have fun 🤗" but then some of them got into my DMs and completely disrespected my music taste, insisted that "It's all Asian, it's the same, so you should love BTS too or something's wrong with you weeb" and I even got into a fight with one because she said some super ignorant things about--not VK or the band--but just metal music in general (didn't help that she attacked Insanity Injection whom I really like but she said "this isn't music, it's people screaming into the mic" and so I just reversed the logic with "[Kpop] is not music, it's meaningless noise created for brainless consoomers"). All of this shit wasn't even on Twitter, it was on fucking anime Instagram posts and random or VK Youtube videos. And nothing, not even saying "I don't like western pop" or "I'm not fond of Jpop myself" calms them down. I've been called racist against Asians because I don't like Kpop--never mind the fact that I'm on this forum so that says something about what I think about Asian people--I'M FROM ASIA. I don't even pass for white more than like 25% of the time... Honestly, it just makes me more and more irate as the years go by, because I was so open minded about it and willing to be friendly and actually listen to their damn band recommendations. At this rate I'll be an unironic Anti before I'm legally old enough to pour my own drinks. 

 

That background is needed to understand my current stance. I did genuinely try to get into Kpop; I started with BTS like they all tell you to and I listened to about 5 different releases of theirs.

 

 I was far from impressed. They sounded behind the times. Not in a charming way, but in a way that made me feel... Uncomfortable? I recognized the electronica-infused choruses and hip-hop inspired verses from Western pop music and even some elements from 2010s fads like tropical house production [God I hated that fad] and asked myself "Why is this any better than the white people stuff?" I don't think it is. I think it's on par, personally. I think this stems from an issue Kpop fans have. They can't just call a mediocre album a mediocre album, or even acknowledge a bad song/album because of hype. It's all got to be amazing, flawless, like the second coming of Christ. Honestly, even bands I consider to be absolutely amazing have some songs I don't hype because they're a step in wrong direction or have questionable production choices, but when I say "Yeah, this album is pretty great, but stay away from track X Y Z, they're not the best" the person receiving my recommendation often finds it funny and listens anyway, and then we can have a laugh about how weird it was for a VK band to do Ska or for the vocalist to think that now's the time to try opera vocals for the first time in his life. Sometimes I even completely shit on a band I love because they're an acquired taste or have an endearing charm and originality that lacks any and all technical savoir-faire. 

 

 

Personally, I don't understand how anyone from any counterculture/alternative music group (wassup punks and Goths) could be really into something mainstream at the same time, I thought we gathered around this stuff because it was alternative and had messages in it that differ from the mainstream.  Sure, you could remark on all the Oshare bands that aren't particularly deep or meaningful to say that VK in general is artistically bankrupt but it also wouldn't be fair if I pretended that this whole scene is just deliciously layered social/political commentary like Diru or idiosyncratic cultural experimentalism like Guruguru Eigakan.  On the mainstream aspect, I mean, the mainstream kind of defines the space that creates a counterculture. It's not what they are. Well I mean, what's not mainstream is the they, and mainstream is the us. I think this sense of othering VK bands and fans experience is central to the culture's structure, as something that exists as a byproduct of failed standard conformation. 

 

 I don't know how some VK fans can up and leave for Kpop so quick. Maybe they just liked the Oshare stuff, I guess, but I can't believe they would leave behind all the great post-punk, experimental, speed metal, alt-rock, etc. groups behind when Kpop doesn't offer anything similar. When I listen to pop music, I long for that missing guitar solo, or lack of Jpop chords (if it's Western pop music). Also the PVs are completely different--least from what I see. Every Kpop group I've seen is good at dancing. Hella good. And I've been doing dance for 8 years of my life, I know good technique and stage presence when I see it. When I say that, you might be shocked to know that I still prefer VK PVs where the bandomen just stare at the camera and sulk, or dance around while playing guitar or something. There's been masterful executions of this simple formula, like in cali≠gari's 歪んだ鏡 which legit gave me nightmares of Hage Shuuji staring into my soul.  Might be a false positive because that song dredges some mental trauma other than his face but my point still stands. There's also a lot of PVs that don't have killer dance moves but have a lot of creative spirit to them, like BUCK-TICK's EMPTY GIRL or literally anything Malice Mizer filmed, and that's the stuff I like the most. I've lost interest in big-budget MVs, and prefer a smaller scale spectacle.

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There's a lot of money involved in the production of k-pop so that it sounds good or whatever, but the artists suck lol. Most of them are actually really bad singers, but they fix it in post. So yeah, I don't think it necessarily sounds bad, but it's definitely overrated. 

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15 hours ago, Total Saikou said:

It's penis music lol. Okay, I'm not here to talk shit about pop music, especially not Kpop. There's more artistic merit to it than some give it, and many perfectly sane Kpop fans get unfairly lumped in with the Stans. 

 

But man, I used to be really neutral and happy towards Kpop back when I first got into VK, y'know, being like "Hey guys, let's all get along and talk music and have fun 🤗" but then some of them got into my DMs and completely disrespected my music taste, insisted that "It's all Asian, it's the same, so you should love BTS too or something's wrong with you weeb" and I even got into a fight with one because she said some super ignorant things about--not VK or the band--but just metal music in general (didn't help that she attacked Insanity Injection whom I really like but she said "this isn't music, it's people screaming into the mic" and so I just reversed the logic with "[Kpop] is not music, it's meaningless noise created for brainless consoomers"). All of this shit wasn't even on Twitter, it was on fucking anime Instagram posts and random or VK Youtube videos. And nothing, not even saying "I don't like western pop" or "I'm not fond of Jpop myself" calms them down. I've been called racist against Asians because I don't like Kpop--never mind the fact that I'm on this forum so that says something about what I think about Asian people--I'M FROM ASIA. I don't even pass for white more than like 25% of the time... Honestly, it just makes me more and more irate as the years go by, because I was so open minded about it and willing to be friendly and actually listen to their damn band recommendations. At this rate I'll be an unironic Anti before I'm legally old enough to pour my own drinks. 

 

That background is needed to understand my current stance. I did genuinely try to get into Kpop; I started with BTS like they all tell you to and I listened to about 5 different releases of theirs.

 

 I was far from impressed. They sounded behind the times. Not in a charming way, but in a way that made me feel... Uncomfortable? I recognized the electronica-infused choruses and hip-hop inspired verses from Western pop music and even some elements from 2010s fads like tropical house production [God I hated that fad] and asked myself "Why is this any better than the white people stuff?" I don't think it is. I think it's on par, personally. I think this stems from an issue Kpop fans have. They can't just call a mediocre album a mediocre album, or even acknowledge a bad song/album because of hype. It's all got to be amazing, flawless, like the second coming of Christ. Honestly, even bands I consider to be absolutely amazing have some songs I don't hype because they're a step in wrong direction or have questionable production choices, but when I say "Yeah, this album is pretty great, but stay away from track X Y Z, they're not the best" the person receiving my recommendation often finds it funny and listens anyway, and then we can have a laugh about how weird it was for a VK band to do Ska or for the vocalist to think that now's the time to try opera vocals for the first time in his life. Sometimes I even completely shit on a band I love because they're an acquired taste or have an endearing charm and originality that lacks any and all technical savoir-faire. 

 

 

Personally, I don't understand how anyone from any counterculture/alternative music group (wassup punks and Goths) could be really into something mainstream at the same time, I thought we gathered around this stuff because it was alternative and had messages in it that differ from the mainstream.  Sure, you could remark on all the Oshare bands that aren't particularly deep or meaningful to say that VK in general is artistically bankrupt but it also wouldn't be fair if I pretended that this whole scene is just deliciously layered social/political commentary like Diru or idiosyncratic cultural experimentalism like Guruguru Eigakan.  On the mainstream aspect, I mean, the mainstream kind of defines the space that creates a counterculture. It's not what they are. Well I mean, what's not mainstream is the they, and mainstream is the us. I think this sense of othering VK bands and fans experience is central to the culture's structure, as something that exists as a byproduct of failed standard conformation. 

 

 I don't know how some VK fans can up and leave for Kpop so quick. Maybe they just liked the Oshare stuff, I guess, but I can't believe they would leave behind all the great post-punk, experimental, speed metal, alt-rock, etc. groups behind when Kpop doesn't offer anything similar. When I listen to pop music, I long for that missing guitar solo, or lack of Jpop chords (if it's Western pop music). Also the PVs are completely different--least from what I see. Every Kpop group I've seen is good at dancing. Hella good. And I've been doing dance for 8 years of my life, I know good technique and stage presence when I see it. When I say that, you might be shocked to know that I still prefer VK PVs where the bandomen just stare at the camera and sulk, or dance around while playing guitar or something. There's been masterful executions of this simple formula, like in cali≠gari's 歪んだ鏡 which legit gave me nightmares of Hage Shuuji staring into my soul.  Might be a false positive because that song dredges some mental trauma other than his face but my point still stands. There's also a lot of PVs that don't have killer dance moves but have a lot of creative spirit to them, like BUCK-TICK's EMPTY GIRL or literally anything Malice Mizer filmed, and that's the stuff I like the most. I've lost interest in big-budget MVs, and prefer a smaller scale spectacle.

I agree, particularly with "They can't just call a mediocre album a mediocre album, or even acknowledge a bad song/album because of hype. It's all got to be amazing, flawless, like the second coming of Christ."

Becuase it is what it is. It's a fad, a cultural phenomenon, something that's so good right now! even if it actually sucks, is actually losing its shine etc. because now international media has appropriated it to the point of making it seem like a political agenda its original creators never reeeally intended it to be, y'know. And, well, my point being exactly that they did intend it to be a political agenda... a lot. Just probably not to this degree.

 

But - it's somewhat akin to what anime was in the past, right? The whole "anime aesthetic", "anime game" (which was literally just: japanese game with cartoon graphics ... lol ; ; ; ), "anime whatever" of the 90s and maybe even early 2000s. And it was cool around the world, and then suddenly it wasn't cool anymore. Before that, the hippies were cool, etc. Think of whatever cultural fad to illustrate my perspective.    

 

So, I guess what I was trying to argue before is exactly that - sure VK was never terribly mainstream, but everyone who's like 30 now probably lived an era when it was, at the very least ... cool. In a, y'know, oh, ok, these kids with the colorful Final Fantasy hairstyles are actually creating something artistically new. Until, again, it wasn't anymore. And before not being cool anymore of course it was appropriated in many ways - it's not really a coincidence that every bandomen from back then suddenly became ~*multicultural and global*~. Anyway... So it's not really a coincidence that some elements are present in both because, well, pop culture/media/etc works like that. Not to say "nothing is new" but of course some trends will be literal emulations or polar opposites of others. Making these "others"' presence undeniable.   

 

Edited by Chell

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have enjoyed some korean pop songs before like one from Lena Park, but these are not the modern "This is Kpop" stuff by any means.

Lots of it seems ,even for pop, to be a bit too contrived. Hats off to them for using their cultural complexes to fuel a thriving industry though.

Great production value but nothing with any soul. Like over using Quantization on a performance to the point where all life has left it but you sure do

have something that lines up on every beat. If that kind of music makes you happy though, different strokes for. . .

 

At a club I do designs for I saw some BTS on their TV backgrounds and it was all kinds of ridiculous watching these super skinny baby faced guys trying to act hard

and imitate black gangster culture.

 

Edited by ghostpepper

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18 hours ago, ghostpepper said:

At a club I do designs for I saw some BTS on their TV backgrounds and it was all kinds of ridiculous watching these super skinny baby faced guys trying to act hard

and imitate black gangster culture.

Someone who knows better about kpop imitating black culture should tackle this but yeah, it's a thing. Thankfully a thing that my Shinee boys don't do. Hopefully? 

 

I live in south east asia so kpop is unavoidable for me. I can only speak for myself, but what I noticed around me was that the people who first got into kpop weren't into jpop.

 

They were 'mainstream normies' so to speak, so 2000s kpop being more accessible from the start meant that they had much greater exposure to kpop than jpop in the first place. My general impression back then was that kpop was seen as 'fresher',  'more polished' than jpop which has been around for a few years already. So there was the general public getting into kpop + jpop/vk/etc fans getting into kpop but little to no fans gained for jpop/vk. So that was that. Though it was obvious that kpop was taking trend cues from japanese music, like how early dbsk had visual kei hairstyles lol. But they quickly found a style that simply appealed more to the foreign public than jpop/vk did imo. I mean, they had government backing, so....

 

What I dislike about kpop is how they pigeonhole members, like oh guy 1 is the singer, guy 2 is rap and so on. It's weird how they introduce themselves explicitly like that. Of course they have their own strengths but why do that?

 

I don't know about 2010 kpop but I think the surviving groups and artists from 2000s kpop are still quite good and are beginning to have their own musical input.

 

I specifically like songs (partially) written and composed by Donghae of Suju for some reason:

Spoiler

 

 

Also key's solo albums are prime kpop goodness. 

 

Odd eye best kpop album of the decade tbh, bts can't compare

 

 

 

Edited by gret

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Too manufactured and I don't respect the industry. I prefer an industry where the artists have creative freedom it has nothing to do with whether I like or dislike pop or rap music or anything of the sort. I can respect artists in any genre if I feel like what they're doing is genuine and heart felt. 

 

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8 hours ago, lichtlune said:

Too manufactured and I don't respect the industry. I prefer an industry where the artists have creative freedom it has nothing to do with whether I like or dislike pop or rap music or anything of the sort. I can respect artists in any genre if I feel like what they're doing is genuine and heart felt. 

 

That video is a gem lol

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On 3/31/2020 at 10:44 AM, Total Saikou said:

"It's all Asian, it's the same, so you should love BTS too or something's wrong with you weeb"

 

 I've been called racist against Asians because I don't like Kpop

 

I don't know how some VK fans can up and leave for Kpop so quick

 

Firstly, (hopefully) we can all agree that people that carry out these kinds of personal attacks are pretentious af. 

SECONDLY, that's just plain weird.

As a kid I came across Super Junior and absolutely loved their colorful mvs-Rokugo esp. Didn't really become a fan since I did find everything to be a bit too manufactured and controlled for my liking but  that's just personal preference. I was a tween when the bts boom begun and quite honestly I was  glad that such thing was taking place since I thought that people would become a bit more accepting of minorities, you know?

Still,,,

Never got into kpop but imma be a bitch baby and say that the fandom could be a tad calmer about... Stuff. Just that. Imo kpop is okay!

Edited by AnchuAnchor

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On 5/18/2020 at 8:56 AM, AnchuAnchor said:

Firstly, (hopefully) we can all agree that people that carry out these kinds of personal attacks are pretentious af. 

SECONDLY, that's just plain weird.

As a kid I came across Super Junior and absolutely loved their colorful mvs-Rokugo esp. Didn't really become a fan since I did find everything to be a bit too manufactured and controlled for my liking but  that's just personal preference. I was a tween when the bts boom begun and quite honestly I was  glad that such thing was taking place since I thought that people would become a bit more accepting of minorities, you know?

Still,,,

Never got into kpop but imma be a bitch baby and say that the fandom could be a tad calmer about... Stuff. Just that. Imo kpop is okay!

Solidarity in liking Asian music can only go so far, especially considering that we're in different genre camps at all times. And yeah, Kpop stans are... something else. Never had any other fandom accuse me of being racist against my own place of origin, they are true trailblazers :staru: 

Edited by Total Saikou

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On 3/31/2020 at 3:44 PM, Total Saikou said:

I think this stems from an issue Kpop fans have. They can't just call a mediocre album a mediocre album, or even acknowledge a bad song/album because of hype. It's all got to be amazing, flawless, like the second coming of Christ. 

I'll just leave this here, fresh from my country today:

 

https://www.asiaone.com/digital/k-pop-fans-kick-straitstimesisoverparty-twitter-report-their-idols-they-didnt?utm_medium=Social&utm_source=Facebook&fbclid=IwAR2g2zwRNI9qxk3WmaG10OFH5ogjgc9dmgFkS2rPaTQ96LAxbInRdfv6AV8#Echobox=1589956772

 

Basically the newspaper published a less than flattering article on some kpop stars and the fans are trying to boycott the newspapers and get the writer fired.

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2 hours ago, sads123 said:

I'll just leave this here, fresh from my country today:

 

https://www.asiaone.com/digital/k-pop-fans-kick-straitstimesisoverparty-twitter-report-their-idols-they-didnt?utm_medium=Social&utm_source=Facebook&fbclid=IwAR2g2zwRNI9qxk3WmaG10OFH5ogjgc9dmgFkS2rPaTQ96LAxbInRdfv6AV8#Echobox=1589956772

 

Basically the newspaper published a less than flattering article on some kpop stars and the fans are trying to boycott the newspapers and get the writer fired.

Ooh remember eutuxeite?

https://www.scmp.com/culture/music/article/2181313/k-pop-fans-force-apology-after-racist-remarks-about-bts-exo-and-wanna

Ofc what the host(s) said was unacceptable

 

Edited by AnchuAnchor

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To be perfectly honest K-Pop music or industry in general isnt my cup of tea. But neither I hate them.

 

My only problem is the fans. Some of them really goes overboard or too much. Hell even one of my friends said she would be super happy just to kiss her idol's armpit. Like wtf, seriously?

 

I mean, based on what I learn, most of them only care about the visual a.k.a handsome or pretty idols. Which is FOR ME is kinda weird, because music isnt for their ears anymore, but eyes.

 

Note: I know not all of the fans behave like that, but I swear some of my friends are.

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There were some years i listened to Kpop, some years active following up on everything some years just runing through the same old stuff. 

Its easy on the ears, you get easy into a new song, because of how much they sound the same. 

The thing i noticed how i got used to this over time of listening. 

They always have that obligatory rap part inside somewhere.  i personally think its the most noticable thing, even if you have no idea about music you will notice that at one point every group needed a rapper. 

Eitherway we all know the music is generic crap. 

The fandoms are hell (apparently some groups have nice fandoms)

I am tired of seeing fancams on twitter everywhere. 

Visual wise they all  look the same. 

Plastic surgery everywhere

Sexualising minors

I could go on with the stuff that annoys me on kpop, but lets stop it

I am just waiting for the third generation groups to finally get some nice scandals. (i mean second generations kpop had some shit going on)

The only thing i still listen to sometimes are Wonder Girls.

 

Oh, yes, also thanks to those JO1 guys the kpop fandom kept attacking the jpop fandom for a while on twitter. It was fun. 

Last but not least, i think KPop has some actually good singers out there, Its just hard to know when they have to sing and perform some crazy dance performance at the same time. Or they get like 3 words inside the whole song. They have dancers that are good, but that doesn't mean they can sing. They have good rappers, but that doesn't mean they can dance. 

 

Also i remember seeing some live stuff from bts and don't get me wrong, but it was crap. First off, those microphones that are around your head are mostly shit eitherway, second they wasnt able to keep the singing up during the dancing, which didn't surpise me in the least. 

 

Ah. sorry it got long and like always i feel its chaotic 

 

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I personally got into k-pop back in 2010. Was obsessed with SHINee and SNSD and whoever was big at the time. The older I got, the more I heard about the industry, what the idols are put through and I lost interest in the genre. I would only really keep up with Jonghyun because he was one of my favorite pop artists in general. I think his death, along with those of Sulli's and Goo Hara, really made me legit DESPISE the genre and the industry behind it. These days, I don't have anything against the artists or their songs. Idgaf about mindless fun pop music as long as the messages aren't harmful. It's just the industry makes me feel sick. 

 

Plus the fans never learn. Every time a K-pop celebrity dies from suicide, they cry on twitter about it (nothing wrong with that) but then the next week they go back to bullying each other and other k-pop idols, saying truly heinous shit. They should just stick to liking the music and trolling Trump.

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1 hour ago, nikuman said:

I personally got into k-pop back in 2010. Was obsessed with SHINee and SNSD and whoever was big at the time. The older I got, the more I heard about the industry, what the idols are put through and I lost interest in the genre. I would only really keep up with Jonghyun because he was one of my favorite pop artists in general. I think his death, along with those of Sulli's and Goo Hara, really made me legit DESPISE the genre and the industry behind it. These days, I don't have anything against the artists or their songs. Idgaf about mindless fun pop music as long as the messages aren't harmful. It's just the industry makes me feel sick. 

 

Plus the fans never learn. Every time a K-pop celebrity dies from suicide, they cry on twitter about it (nothing wrong with that) but then the next week they go back to bullying each other and other k-pop idols, saying truly heinous shit. They should just stick to liking the music and trolling Trump.

Sort of relatable (except it's more how I feel about anime since the KyoAni arson but k-pop is quickly walking towards that for me)

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i agree , kpop is a cringy genre idk how girls can watch those  guys and ppl dancing all swaggy and stuff . cant stand the genre and way they dress to market the genre i guess what makes it so popular i personally never falled for their music or langauge . i prefer jpop or VK or even out of context atmospheric black metal or noise or american pop over KPOP. just no i feel they copy other countries ideas mostly japans also

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